Q&A: Shidduchim

So maybe we'll try to address a little bit the questions pertaining to shidduchim. The questions here that were submitted: what should we look for in a wife? How important are the factors of family, location, and other points outside of the person herself? Maybe before we get to that, one can't look for an ezer kenegdo until there's a certain amount of self-definition that one has about oneself. And that's why it's not uncommon that sometimes in the course of dating, there can be an element of self-discovery and self-definition. To make the decision to marry someone, so there needs to be a common direction, a common set of goals, ideals, aspirations. There needs to be common ground in terms of hashkafa. And all of these commonalities require that a person have a certain amount of self-understanding and self-definition as well. So the truth is that before one begins to identify priorities in looking for a wife, so one has to, again, first engage in a certain amount of to make sure that one has self-definition and that one's own sense of direction is identified. Sometimes that has just happened naturally over the course of the years. Sometimes what it owes to, whether it just owes to a certain family traditions and family mesorah, and sometimes it will be due to influence of rebbeim, and sometimes it will be due to one's own careful thinking, sometimes it will be an interplay between those various factors. But even before, again, trying to identify the qualities in one's ezer kenegdo, so one has to first have some self-definition. What are the qualities one looks for? I said mezuyan, that's where the floor begins. And again, chesed is a defining quality for men and for women. רחמנים בישנים גומלי חסדים. It's a defining quality for men and women. That having been said, it's even more defining and even more critical within a woman's avodas Hashem, within a woman's role in the family than it is for a man, which is not to minimize or downplay the centrality of chesed in a man's religious persona, in a man's religious life, in his avodas Hashem, but without downplaying that an iota, it looms even larger in a woman's avodas Hashem and certainly that is a primary. Alongside that, tzniyus is also something which is very, very vital. And tzniyus, again, not only in its externalities, although in that respect as well, but tzniyus is a... it's not only a code of dress, it's a demeanor, it's a code of behavior. The idea which is reflected in a code of dress of not calling attention to oneself is what tzniyus is an expression of tzniyus in other areas as well. A sense of being, again, not out of any lack of self-esteem or self-confidence, but not calling attention to oneself. Okay, one can call attention to oneself by dressing inappropriately, but one can call attention to oneself in many other ways as well. And again, when we're talking about manifestation of tzniyus, so it should be, again, tzniyus as a way of life, as a demeanor, as a mode of behavior and living, not just tzniyus in terms of dress code. And again, the centrality of tzniyus for a woman is not to... not to imply for a moment that it isn't pivotal in a man's life as well, but as pivotal as it is in a man's life, lema'aseh כל כבודה בת מלך פנימה says that it's even more pivotal and magnified even more within a woman's avodas Hashem and alongside chesed one is certainly looking for an isha tznua. Perhaps a good litmus test in knowing whether or not a particular young lady is suitable, is not suitable, is that one should ask oneself whether he would be happy if the Ribbono Shel Olam blesses him with daughters that the daughters should grow up to be like her. Sometimes people get distracted from that in dating. Sometimes in dating, so appropriately, appropriately they notice whether or not they have a good time with the other person, and that's entirely appropriate to notice that and to weigh that. But you can have a good time with someone, you can think someone's a lot of fun, but not necessarily want your daughters to grow up to be that way. A lot of people that we interact with, that we... again, it can be not for purposes of shidduch, it can be same-gender relationships and friendships. A lot of people whom we consider a lot of fun, very enjoyable to spend time with, but you wouldn't necessarily want that to be your son's role model or you wouldn't necessarily want that person to be a potentially formative influence in your son's life. And it's very important in dating, again, to enjoy spending time with a person is an important siman and it's something which carries weight, but it shouldn't be something which distracts one from an ultimate question of: is this someone whom I would want potentially to exert a formative influence on my daughters? Is this someone whom I would want to be a role model for my daughters? Lema'aseh, fathers can and should be very involved with chinuch habanos. Fathers can and should have a very, very close relationship with not only their sons, but their daughters as well. as well. But obviously it remains true that in in in certain respects because of the the difference in in roles for the genders that in certain respects a mother can be a role model for her daughters in a sense that that a father can’t. The same way as close as the relationship is between a mother and sons, obviously in certain ways a father can be a or certain ways in which a father can be a role model for his sons that a mother can’t. And given given that fact, so one should view one’s potential spouse again not only as a not only as a as a mate for oneself, but you have to also think a little bit further down the road as as someone who’s again intimately involved in chinuch habonim and habonos and especially chinuch habonos. Again, not because not because fathers should not be again intimately and and involved and committed to chinuch habonos, but only because the reality is that in in in certain areas the a woman can be a role model for women in a way that that a man can’t be for obvious reasons. So that’s a good litmus test. A good litmus test is not only not only do do I enjoy spending time with her, but would I want my daughters to to grow up to be like her? Would I be would I be happy, is that would that be the fulfillment of my hopes and aspirations for for any daughters with whom the Ribbono Shel Olam would bless me? There is a from what people tell me I’m not so I’m not so involved I can’t I can’t say firsthand eidus. I can just sort of report ed mipi ed, but but I’m sure you don’t need that. I’m sure you’ve heard the same stories that I have. There there is a there seems to be a big problem nowadays in in terms of overemphasizing appearance and and looks in terms of shidduchim. Now unquestionably it’s the there is a there is a physical component to marriage, and because there is a physical component to marriage, so compatibility on that level is obviously very important and that’s a me'akev in marriage. The same way the same way temperamental compatibility is is is me'akev as well. So too there needs to be a mutual attraction. And no one’s no one’s denying that or even or even downplaying that that’s that’s a me'akev that there needs to be. But there’s a difference between saying that that there needs to be compatibility in that area and between the kind of disproportionate stress and and the disproportionate expectations or demands. It’s one thing to say that there should be mutual attractions, it’s another thing to be looking for someone who can join Chazal’s list in the Gemara in Megillah of the most beautiful women who who ever lived. And and if one finds oneself more noteh in that direction, so then that’s already well beyond what properly and appropriately is part of determining compatibility and and that’s a that’s a major problem bein adam l’atzmo. Besides not being so realistic in terms of shidduchim, but even yavo hayom veyavo that a person that it won’t interfere with a person finding a shidduch, bein adam l’atzmo that’s a major that’s a major issue and something which a person needs to recognize about himself and needs to and needs to address. Again, obviously there’s there’s subjectivity and and it doesn’t mean that if a person. Honestly says that he's not attracted, it doesn't mean that right away guilty as charged, but a person just has to make sure that everything is bimida u'vemishkal in every area, but in this area as well. And from stories that one hears and accounts that are given, it seems like that unfortunately sometimes that is a problem. When we were talking about what qualities to look for, so we didn't talk about the yirat shamayim. Didn't talk about yirat shamayim for the following reason. Amazing, amazing vort from the Maharal. Maharal is explaining the Gemara in Berachos. The Gemara in Berachos says ועתה ישראל מה ה' אלהיך שואל מעמך. So the Gemara says וכי יראה מילתא זוטרתא היא? The Gemara says אין לגבי משה מילתא זוטרתא היא. Okay, so the kasha is obvious. Maharal says something extraordinary. Says like this: He says, again, this is not a verbatim quote, but this is the thrust of what the Maharal says. He says let's say a person ich veis studies physics and all the way through and gets a PhD in physics and really masters that body of knowledge. Okay. You have another person who realizes that he's not a bird and therefore he can't flap his wings and fly and will therefore refrain from going up to the top of Belford and taking off. So with whom are we impressed and with whom are we perhaps not so impressed? So arguably we should be more impressed with the second guy. Second guy's yedia is much more fundamental, much more important yedia. I mean the first guy knows how to split an atom, he can create a bomb and blow up the world. What does that do for us? First guy's more fundamental. So says the Maharal, first guy doesn't know anything, that's just he's in touch with reality. It's not that he's mastered a body of knowledge. He's in touch with reality. He's in touch with reality that he's a person, he's not a bird, and because of that he can't flap his wings and fly. The second guy understands physics, so that's more than just being in touch with reality. That's more than being attuned to reality. That's already he acquired knowledge, he mastered a body of knowledge. That's an accomplishment. He added something, he was mosef something. Says the Maharal יראה מילתא זוטרתא היא. He says a person understands that his life is from the Ribono Shel Olam and the Ribono Shel Olam is the illa, is the cause, the source of everything. He's the ulal, he's the effect, he's the dependent. That's like knowing that I can't flap my wings and fly. Milta zutra hi. That's nothing to be impressed with. That's just being in touch with reality. So avadai she has to be a ba'alas yirat shamayim. Avadai that she also has to know she can't flap her wings and fly also, but we don't necessarily need to list that. Obviously, you note the Vilna Gaon writes, and afterwards the Chofetz Chaim writes as well, that hergel, training and habituation, it's crucial in, I guess, all areas of observance of halacha, but especially when it comes to shmiras halashon. Especially when it comes to shmiras halashon. One should note on dates whether or not the shmiras haloshon is the way it should be and if it's not, it's a major major problem, it's a major chisaron. It's not something which is easily corrected. It can be corrected. אין דבר עומד בפני התשובה בפני הרצון but it's not something that's easily done. Bechlal you marry a person ba'asher hu sham. You can't marry a person banking on change. If there's something in the present which doesn't sit well, so you can't, ninety-nine times out of a hundred, it's not the right thing to say well, but he's going to change, she's going to change. No, you have to marry the person באשר הוא באשר היא שם. If right now there's a glaring chisaron which if it wouldn't change would sink the shidduch, then ninety-nine times out of a hundred, it's not a good idea. How important are factors of family other than the person himself? So obviously secondary, obviously secondary. All things being equal, there is value, there is significance. It's not that they're of no value and of no significance. You know, if Chazal tell us it's an inyan to marry a bas talmid chacham or tzniua ne'ima veyichus, it's not devoid of significance, it's not devoid of value, but it's very much secondary, very much secondary. So that's point number one. Point number two is in terms of such considerations, a person has to know, he has to know himself also. You know, a person may think, you know, I have to marry a bas talmid chacham, but he has to ask himself, you know, is he the kind of guy that talmidei chachamim are looking for as a son-in-law? Otherwise he may have to wait an unduly long time to find a bas talmid chacham. A person has to be realistic about who he is and about what he is in these respects and those sort of individual subjective factors impact very heavily whether one is even lechatchila weighing these things. If one is talking about family not just in terms of yichus, but one is talking about family in other respects, so then it can possibly become an even more significant factor. If someone comes from a broken home, so it poses a question that needs to be answered. It doesn't dictate an answer, but one has to know, did it or did it not leave emotional scars on the person? Now the answer may be no, that it didn't kehu zeh, in which case it's just back to the first area. But it can pose questions which one would need to answer to one's satisfaction if, you know, in the event of a broken family or something. One shouldn't assume the answer, one should try to clarify what the answer is. If there's mental illness in the family, so here too, one needs to make an informed judgment on that. You know if it's mental illness which is thought to be hereditary, so again there's no automatic policy and there isn't even after clarifying all the details of the situation there isn't necessarily an absolute objective answer. But again but it's a question which should be raised and which a person should make an informed personal decision about probably in consultation with others who know him well and also have a little bit more chochmas hachayim than people have at the age when they're getting married. The other question submitted in this category is at what age? So the answer lichora is as follows. I mean al pi din, al pi din, beyond the age twenty a person has to have a reason for not getting married rather than for yes getting married. And that seems to be pretty open and shut. So what's and mi k'amcha yisroel, certainly in certain communities ad hayom hazeh, that's pshuto kemashmao, that's in certain parts of our communities. In other parts obviously that's not the case. So is that legitimate? Is it not legitimate? So there are lichora at least two legitimate reasons for why not every twenty-year-old is married. One is that lichora it's pashut darchei noam. It's pashut that a person is not supposed to get married until he's emotionally mature and emotionally ready to get married. And to get married when one is not sufficiently emotionally mature and for that rachmana litzlan to then translate into an unhappy marriage and because of that rachmana litzlan into divorce there's no that's not what chazal had in mind when they told us to get married by a certain age. That's pashut. The other is that the Rambam paskens that if postponing marriage will allow a person to learn more than he would otherwise so the Rambam says הרי זה מותר להתאחר. So this is provided that he's not beset by hirhurim. So then again beset by hirhurim doesn't mean that a person has an occasional hirhur. That's not what it means and obviously means much more than that. But provided that's not the case so then הרי זה מותר להתאחר if it will allow him to learn more. There is another category that category's not really halacha lemaaseh but the category Ben Azzai that's not relevant to us. But this other category of הרי זה מותר להתאחר so that is relevant. So then the question is הרי זה מותר להתאחר until what age? Until what age? הרי זה מותר להתאחר. So lichora the pshat is that it's not supposed to be to an age again let's say a person he says I'm learning well, I'm not restless and not having reichaim al tzavari certainly allows me to learn more, so is that just open ended? Is the הרי זה מותר להתאחר open ended? The pshat says that that that m'tzius, that sort of the social m'tzius which goes a long way to answering that question in the sense that a person is not supposed to be msacheik to such a point that he puts himself behind the eight ball, he puts himself at a decided disadvantage in in finding a shidduch. הרי זה מותר לשחק, so first I'm 20 years old now, but I want to learn. So first let me go through a cycle of Daf Yomi and then let me go through a cycle of Halacha Yomos and then and Yerushalmi Daf Yomi is like you're not machshiv. Let me now go through... Okay, so then when he's 50 years old he's going to call up the shadchan. The shadchan says that you know, sorry we don't, I don't deal with people over 40. So he's going to be in a bit of hot water. So obviously the הרי זה מותר לשחק is not to a point where a person is already at a disadvantage. So when does that happen? It's hard to say but in our society, in our communities, I don't know, unless one has strong compelling arguments to the contrary, I don't know, k'miduma that it's not advisable to push it off beyond age 23. Again, that doesn't mean that one is m'chuyav to push it off till then but we're talking about what mistama is is the shiur of הרי זה מותר לשחק given our our social reality. I don't really see it much beyond age 23. Okay, that's in terms of the questions that were that were on the sheet. Are there any follow-up questions? I don't know what time it is. Just to strengthen what they were saying earlier about about seeing whether or not someone be, you want your daughters to grow up to be to be like that woman. Studies show today that genetics play a much larger role than we previously thought in in our offspring. And that, you know, a lot of studies have shown that criminals are more likely to, criminals who are adopted are actually are more like their birth parents than like their, it's more likely to have a criminal record like their birth parents than like their adopted parents. So it's just on many many levels that's a very serious consideration. Yishar koach. No that that's... No, that's why sometimes people have different depending upon what their sort of conception of the relationship which they're looking to have with their wives, so sometimes people are wondering you know, so how important is it that she be bright or maybe it's not so important? So besides whatever conception one has of the interaction between husband and wife and on what level one wants that to happen and and be able to play itself out, so even leaving that aside, whatever conceptions a person has there, l'mayseh 50% of your kids' genes as the point is very well made, 50% of your children's genes are you know, are coming from your wife. And if you want your kids to be bright, then I'm not sure how one can overlook that, regardless of what one's... so the the point is very well taken. הרי זה מותר לשחק מסתמא, given things, given that it has to be הרי זה מותר לשחק מסתמא... No, I think you're looking in Hilchos Ishus. It's clearly two different dinim. That there's one din of nafsho chashka b'Torah that no, you're looking in Hilchos Ishus specifically, so it's a different din. They say that you should look for a wife neged d'huvso. So how does that apply when it comes to life issues, for instance? Should one look for somebody who one could discuss life issues on an equal footing? In what areas should one look for somebody who's on an equal footing and some that or on a higher footing or... Right, so that that means that you don't have... I don't think that means that you know there's a famous letter from Akiva Eger. When someone wrote to Akiva Eger suggesting a shidduch for him after his wife had died and I forget how much time had elapsed since his wife's petira and Akiva Eger writes back, it's a famous letter, Akiva Eger writes back and says I don't know what you think I am that you think I'm already ready to remarry, not that much time has elapsed since my wife's petira and he says emotionally I'm not ready at all and he talks about what a great woman she was and then this is the famous line Akiva Eger writes how we used to stay up late into the night talking about inyanei yiras shamayim. So again I don't on the other hand I don't think Akiva Eger discussed Akiva Eger's chabura necessarily. So yeah a wife is not a chavrusah, husband is not a chavrusah but again it depends upon I mean it's a I don't know if there's a right or wrong, it can be subjective, I'm not sure why one wouldn't optimally want to be able to respect one's wife intellectually as well. Again, different people have different some people think that what that means is should we turn off the tapes? I'm not sure, some people think that what that means is you're looking for a wife not a chavrusah is that as long as she's sweet and knows how to make a good kugel then you're okay but I don't know about that. Mistama, mistama there's a lot more that there's a lot more substance that can be there, you know. Well that and that's the famous letter from Akiva Eger. Moving on, there's a Rambam who recommends that one should be able to support himself and a wife before getting married and in the lashon of the kesubah if one's faced with a position where they could either choose a path where they would be koveia itim but working and primarily supporting a family with the wife taking a more secondary role in supporting but a primary role in caretaking or where a person could instead of just being koveia itim but could be learning a lot and only working on the side and with the wife taking on the primary role supporting the family financially, which one of those paths mah naaseh is more appropriate? Hikshesa lish'ol. It's a very very difficult issue. It's very difficult again, לימוד תורה דרך ארץ, right?

לעולם ילמד אדם תורה אחר כך יבנה בית אחר כך ישא אשה.

So it's quite clear what Chazal thought was the idea. On the other hand, it's also true based on the gemara in Kiddushin that it's not as though the system of a married man who was being supported was not unknown bimei Chazal either and the gemara in Kiddushin has the stira about the getting married earlier or later. The gemara says halan vehalo and it means depending upon whether or not there's a source of support after getting married. All that having been said, maybe we should turn off the tape. All that having been said.