Pesach: 4 Banim: Not Responding To The Rasha But Having Clarity On His Questions

Just some some preliminary thoughts rabosai. The Mishna in Pesachim לפי דעתו של בן אביו מלמדו. The Mechilta that that that we quote in the Haggadah

כנגד ארבעה בנים דיברה תורה אחד חכם ואחד רשע ואחד תם ואחד שאינו יודע לשאול.

And then of course the Mechilta then has psukim for the each of the כנגד ארבעה בנים דיברה תורה. The Mishna in in presenting the din of לפי דעתו של בן אביו מלמדו doesn't doesn't allude to the Keneged Arba'ah Banim. Just לפי דעתו של בן אביו מלמדו. The the pshat is is as follows. That din that לפי דעתו של בן אביו מלמדו, that's not the gzeiras hakasuv, that's not the psukim of of

כנגד ארבעה בנים דיברה תורה. לפי דעתו של בן אביו מלמדו

is למה לי קרא סברא הוא. The Alef Bais of chinuch for parents for mechanchim is לפי דעתו של בן אביו מלמדו. You can't you can't talk way over way over a child's head. You have to talk, okay, you you want to you don't talk down either. You want the child to reach, you want the child to you want to elevate. But but if if you want someone who's five foot six to stretch and to push, so you hold it at five foot eight, you hold it at five foot nine, you don't hold it at at fifteen fifteen feet. לפי דעתו של בן אביו מלמדו is a svara. The Mishna doesn't reference any psukim, למה לי קרא סברא הוא. It's it's such a basic fundamental principle, svara hu. So so what then is is the chidush of כנגד ארבעה בנים דיברה תורה? So lichora as follows. The She'eino Yodeia Lishol is that the the father has a chiyuv to initiate even if there is no question, the father's a chiyuv to initiate. What's the chidush of the tam? So the pashus the chidush of the tam is is what the baseline of sippur yetzias Mitzrayim is. What's the minimum below which it's it's not a sippur yetzias Mitzrayim anymore? That minimally you have to be able to communicate כי בחוזק יד הוציאנו השם ממצרים. And and that less than that is if the child is not yet able, capable to to understand that, so that so then it's ich veis, it's like vis-a-vis matzah, it's a קטן שאינו יכול לאכול כזית בכדי אכילת פרס. He's not he's not yet a bar hachi for mitzvas sippur. What's the chidush of the ben chacham? The chidush of the ben chacham is that mitzvas sippur is something which is basically כל המרבה הרי זה משובח. And and therefore if he is a ben chacham, it's not you might have thought whether you might have compared it to to zechiras yetzias Mitzrayim or or maybe you would have ich veis benching. You can have a ben chacham but you don't have to come up with a new text of Bircas HaMazon which is which is more elaborate and which is more embellished for for the ben chacham. There are certain things you're supposed to say and and whether whether the person benching is the Gadol HaDor or whether the person benching is is is is Amcha, so it's the same Bircas HaMazon. I don't know in terms of the kavanos, veis ich nisht, but in terms of what the what the words are that that one says. So that's the chidush of the of the ben chacham. Chidush of the ben chacham is that mitzvas sippur no that there's is that it's בכלל אלו דברים שאין להם שיעור that and. And therefore once you know that, so the principle that לפי דעתו של בנו אביו מלמדו, that's not a parsha. That's a sevara. The psukim come to tell you that afillu lo sha'al you have to initiate. The psukim come to tell us what the threshold is, what the minimum baseline is for sippur below which it's not a sippur. The psukim come to tell us that unlike zechiros yetzias mitzrayim or unlike birchas hamazon or unlike mikra bikkurim, it's something where a person is not just supposed to mention certain themes or certain ideas, but it's kol hamarbeh and therefore the ben chochom should be answered much more fully and much more elaborately than another ben. What's the gzeiras hakasuv then, what's the din of the ben rasha? So there's at least one, possibly two dinim within the ben rasha. First of all, if you learn like the Beis Halevi, the combination of the diyuk that the response to the ben rasha והיה כי יאמרו אליכם בניכם מה העבודה הזאת לכם and then v'amartem zevach pesach, so famously the Beis Halevi points out, the he'arah is before the Beis Halevi also, not necessarily as fully as he says it, that the Torah here doesn't say v'amartem aleihem. So then one gzeiras hakasuv is that you don't engage the ben rasha. It's not li v'lo lo. It's not v'amartem aleihem. You don't engage a ben rasha. A sincere question needs to be answered, should be answered. A brazen, cynical challenge shouldn't be answered. One doesn't engage the ben rasha. That's one part of the gzeiras hakasuv. But the other part of the gzeiras hakasuv is that agam that even if it's in question format, but if it's really just a cynical, brazen challenge, not a sincere question, that the person is not engaged, but אף על פי כן we need to make sure that we have clarity on whatever issue it is that the rasha poses, that the rasha puts forth. According to the way the Ba'alei Hatosafos understand Rabban Gamliel's din of כל שלא אמר שלשה דברים אלו בפסח, so we derive Rabban Gamliel's din from the pasuk v'amartem zevach pesach. That's the makor for Rabban Gamliel's din. So it's remarkable, something so fundamental is we need to make sure our need for clarity, our need for behiris becomes greater, is accentuated and underscored precisely when there's a ben rasha. Agam that again, din number one is it's li v'lo lo, it's not v'amartem aleihem. The ben rasha is not being engaged. Because if the question is just a cynical, contemptuous challenge, so then he's not interested in listening. He's not interested in listening, so there's no inyan to engage that individual. But there is a need yashev hatorah l'yashev da'ateinu, there is a need that we have to be mischazek, that we should have clarity. Yitachen, I don't know, ayan alav, I'm not sure about this. When you look in perek zayin where the Rambam has So the halachos of sipur, so halacha bais,

מצוה להודיע לבנים ואפילו לא שאלו שנאמר והגדת לבנך. לפי דעתו של בן אביו מלמדו.

Keitzad?

אם היה קטן או טיפש אומר לו בני כולנו היינו עבדים כשפחה זו או כעבד זה במצרים ובלילה הזה פדה אותנו הקדוש ברוך הוא ויוציאנו לחירות. ואם היה הבן גדול וחכם מודיעו מה שאירע לנו במצרים וניסים שנעשו לנו על ידי משה רבינו הכל לפי דעתו של בן.

So for the katan or tipesh, afillu lo sha'alu, so the Rambam has the eini yodeia lishol, he has the tam, he has the chacham, he doesn't have the rasha here in the halachos. Obviously in the Haggadah he has the Mechilta of כנגד ארבעה בנים דברה תורה. But why is there no allusion here to the ben rasha? So itachen again that the din of the ben rasha is not really a din in sipur yetzias Mitzrayim. Again, the gezeiras hakasuv of the ben rasha, the gezeiras hakasuv of the she'eino yodeia lishol is a din in sipur yetzias Mitzrayim, that there's a chiyuv afillu lo sha'alu. The gezeiras hakasuv, the chidush of the din of the ben tam tells us again what the threshold, what the minimum contours of mitzvas sipur are. The gezeiras hakasuv, the chidush of the ben chacham again is to tell us that unlike other mitzvos, so here it's not just mention certain things of vegam anachnu, no, it's כל המרבה הרי זה משובח. So therefore for the ben chacham is אף אתה אמור לו like the Gra says, עד אין מפטירין אחר הפסח אפיקומן. The ben rasha, a, that you don't engage the ben rasha the way the Beis Halevi says, b, but that adaraba, but that we need to be mischazek and make sure that we have clarity on whatever it is that he cynically challenging. So itachen that that's not a din in sipur, that's a general din and maybe that's why the Rambam here doesn't mention the ben rasha in the halachos. Be that as it may, it's a very, very important din. Even when the medubar is not fixing the label and deciding who's a rasha, who isn't a rasha, unless it's nogeia l'dina, unless a person has to know whether an individual is kasher l'eidus or not kasher l'eidus, unless a person has to know whether an individual is ne'eman in a certain context or not ne'eman in a certain context, so then it's not our business to go around fixing labels and that's not our focus. That's not the focal point to attach labels. But the din is true even when one leaves aside labels of rasha rachmana litzlan, that when one lives amidst confusion, so the gezeiras hakasuv of v'amartem zevach pesach is that we have to make sure that we have a behirus on those issues where we're exposed to those who are confused. And it becomes again, it's a chiyuv hein on a Rebbe, hein on a talmid. It's a chiyuv on a Rebbe again to pay attention to that, to try to initiate, to provide that clarity. But it's also a chiyuv on the talmid, if for whatever reason that hasn't been forthcoming or not forthcoming sufficiently for whatever reason, so it becomes בכלל לא הבישן למד. What part of what lo habayshan lamed means in such a context is even when a person knows that the question is wrong, what the Torah is teaching us by the gezeiras hakasuv of v'amartem zevach pesach. is that when we live in confused times where there is confusion, that it's not enough to know that it's confusion, but it's very important to have a behiros, to have a clarity in those areas where people are confused. The behiros can come depending upon what the confusion is and how the confusion manifests itself. It can be in either of two different ways. Sometimes the behiros can be in the form of an answer for ourselves, again, not for those who are not unfortunately interested or open to or receptive to hearing. It can be in the form of answers. And sometimes it's not in the form of an answer because the whole point is that the question is misdirected, that the question is phrased and presented in categories that are totally wrong and inappropriate. The ben rasha asks מה העבודה הזאת לכם and the answer is זבח פסח הוא לה' dahaynu that often the chizuk, the clarity that one needs to reinforce for oneself, again, it's not so much an answer because as the question or pseudo-question is formulated is wrong. It can't and shouldn't be even for ourselves responded to in those terms, in those categories. The question, the pseudo-question is מה העבודה הזאת לכם and the answer is no, that's not what it is, it's not מה העבודה הזאת לכם. The answer is זבח פסח הוא לה'. Whether it is or isn't a din, gezeiras hakosuv within sippur yetzias mitzrayim and again yitochein hamashma'us in the Rambam in the halochos is that it isn't. It certainly is a din with applications that go well beyond mitzvas sippur and it's a very very important yesod and especially in our day.